First spawn - small tank

[nebelhund]

I have 4 Angels in a 12 gallon tank at work. Got them about quarter size, none really big, 1st spawn.

Female laid eggs on the side glass, funny, gave tank a good cleaning Fri PM and Mon AM they are laying eggs. The male is much bigger, had pretty much killed one of the non-spawing angels in the tank, and is showing his dominance over the 4th angel. I took those two home tonight.

The parents are still in the tank, should I leave them in with the eggs?

I saw the other spawn thread about eggs on the water intake. I don't think I could get mine out if I wanted to.

Any advice? (The whole office was enjoying watching the show today. Very cool day.)

Thanks!

[bunnie1978]

It's a good idea to leave the parents in and give them a go! Never know, they might be good parents. Most aren't the first time around though. If you have gravel in the tank it will be difficult for the parents to fetch fallen eggs, which will probably happen if you use tap water... Don't have high expectations first time around though. If you take the parents out, you'll haveto change the set-up with extra aeration and treat for fungus (H2O2 works OK) and there's no way you're going to get the eggs out, they stay very soft right up until hatching.

[nebelhund]

Cool, I'll leave them in then. The bottom is black sand, so they may be ok with dropped eggs.

[ree123]

And,...If the eggs are on the glass they would be almost impossible to remove without harming them. Just watch and enjoy this go around. Then after this spawn is hatched, or fungused, or whatever happens to them; then put in a slopping piece of stone or slate, leaning it up against the glass. The next spawn, which will be in several weeks, should end up on the slopping piece of whatever you place in the tank and you can remove it to hatch artifically if you desire. Remember for the eggs and wigglers to hatch properly the water temp. needs to be near 80 and stay there.
Also, you did a good thing removing the other 2 Angels. They would have been killed if you hadn't.
Keep us posted !!!!!

[angel]

The best thing when you can is to remove the parents. If you want the eggs to hatch and the parents to stay healthy raising them yourself is the best way. The eggs do not fungus because the parents are removed or because it's a first spawn--they fungus because infertile ones fungus unless something is put in the water to stop this from happening. Namely, methylene blue. This fungus then spreads to the infertile ones. Something that wasn't mentioned--provided you get a hatch, and most often the parents do eat them but saying they don't, the babies start out their lives by eating off the sides of the parents. This damages and in some case kills your angels. Cannibalistic, yes, but that's what they do. A piece of slate for next time is the best thing! Congrats.

[bunnie1978]

I've never heard of angels eating off the sides of their parents. I know that's true for Discus.

Raising eggs yourself is the best way. For now, DO NOT add Meth Blue... It stains EVERYTHING! You should get another shot in 11-14 days after the eggs are gone. If you put in the slate hopefully you'll have the opportunity to raise them, if that's what you want to do. In any case, 12 gallons is too small for 4 adult angels, so I would recommend NOT putting back the other two.

Let us know how it goes!! You should start to see some of the eggs turning white... maybe even alot of them. If most of them turn white, it's a good idea to manually remove them before they get too fungusy - for the health of the adults.

[angel]

You don't put the methylene blue in with the fish, by the way. It goes in with eggs only. And it kills plants.

[angel]

www.petfish.net/angelfish.htm
I've read this in a few articles and been told of it by an experienced angelfish hobbyist but for time's sake here's the first article I've run across supporting the angelfish eating the parents' sides theory.

[bunnie1978]

Thanks for that info. It seems some of the articles indicate that happens if there isn't enough food available for fry, which makes sense because if it were the normal thing, I would expect to have seen it. Interesting though. I have the opposite problem- I overfeed my fry. I haven't figured out how much they eat!!

[angel]

It also says it takes a few weeks so watch them.